39 replies to this topic

[TCUSA]

A Stratfor email released in the Wikileaks Global Intelligence Files (and this wasn't between Stratfor and clients, but two officials of Stratfor) states that John McCain's campaign didn't challenge the fraud because the outcome would not have changed even had he won either or both of those states and, more importantly, he feared that a challenge would cause massive civil unrest (because we are dealing with liberals--children--after all).

But hey--those picture ID's that you need if you're going to do anything else in this country are just too damned inconvenient to vote, aren't they?

[Whisky Dude]

You have to learn the board rules T. They go a little something like this....

Democrats/left= Good

Republicans/right= Evil

This about sums it up....LOL


Another variation goes a little something like this........Whenever a democrat is caught doing something wrong, it is to be trivialized. It either A.....Did not happen at all, or B....its a trivial matter that we shouldnt be wasting any time talking about.

When ever a Republican gets caught doing something wrong it is an opportunity to maximize the damage. It is a green light to go on a 2 week rant about the evils of conservatism. Witness the Sandra Fluke spazz out where Rushbo was magically given the power to be the voice of the entire Conservative base....LOL

[The Uniballer]

But hey--those picture ID's that you need if you're going to do anything else in this country are just too damned inconvenient to vote, aren't they?

Would photo ID's have stopped the ballot stuffing?

[Whisky Dude]

Would photo ID's have stopped the ballot stuffing?

Yes........to a major extent.

Many times when strict laws are put into place they can have the effect of putting people on notice. It lets them KNOW these actions are no longer to be tolerated.

Like the strict drunk driving laws most states now have. NO LAW can make a person not drive drunk. But a fear of the penalties in the law can be used to modify behavior. This is why drunk driving is on the decline in every state that adopted these type of laws.

[oldscribe]

My Ohio relatives (Democrats all the way) are convinced that it was voter fraud that elected a Republican governor and a GOP state rep in their district....

[SFA Frog]

First, that email shows absolutely nothing except that people think it could have happened. There is nothing concrete in it and they offer no proof of anything. They just make accusations.

Second, if ballot stuffing is occuring, ballot stuffing will continue even if I have to show my photo ID. The solution has nothing to do with solving the problem. It is like calling for speeding to be a felony to curb auto theft and then saying that auto theft will be reduced because of this new speeding law because thieves might speed away after they steal the car.

Why are people so fixated on laws to keep people from voting rather than trying to fix the voter fraud that occurs after we vote and that almost every article about voter fraud that we seem actually to be seeing? Election fraud is already a crime. Why don't we enforce the laws we have before adding new ones, especially before we add new ones that don't address the problem.

[KillerFrog InD KitchenSink]

I'd like to see computer analysis used to detect systematic voter fraud. You can look at precinct by precinct reults year to year and find outliers (like ballot stuffing) pretty easy I would think.

Voter ID laws do nothing for systematic fraud. In order to utilise the "pose as another voter" to commit fraud you'd have to 1. know that a person is on the roll to vote and 2. know that that person isn't going to vote. The effort and coordination to take advantage of that on a scale that would actually matter would be prohibitive.

OTOH, systematic voter fraud like ballot stuffing, or "ballot losing", would get you a lot more bang for the buck. Those are the things we should spend effort and money on preventing.

[TCUSA]

Good lord, you people are so blinded by your "photo ID's are oppressive" crap that you can't see the forest for the trees. YES, photo ID's stop ballot stuffing--because you can't use somebody else's name to vote when you have to provide proof of your identity! Eric Holder's ballot was offered to James O'Keefe because O'Keefe wasn't required to show any proof of his identity. Had O'Keefe voted, no one would be any the wiser. You people seem to be living in the past when a photo ID wasn't an official document and didn't have all the anti-counterfeiting built into it. It's idiotic to think that photo ID's wouldn't prevent ballot stuffing.

[SFA Frog]

Good lord you people are so blinded by the photo ID stop systematic voter fraud that you can't see the forest for the trees. As someone who has made a few thousand ID badges, making realistic fake IDs wouldn't be hard.

I still don't understand why people are so dead set on voter ID law to fix a problem, that if it truly exists at a level that is effecting election outcomes, is much bigger than any voter ID law could ever fix. If systematic fraud is occurring, me showing up with with a photo ID isn't going to stop it. Laws governing the registration process might change it. Laws governing the system used to manage registrations might change it. Laws making stiffer penalties for fraud by election workers might change it. Forcing someone to show up with a DL probably won't change it.

So now that I have to show an ID, I fake an ID to register. I use that same fake ID to vote. I still don't effect much in my fraud unless I'm doing it a few hundred to a fee thousand times. Just like before there was a voter ID law, I still haven't done much to change the outcome of the election. I still have put more time and money into my fraud than my fraud will pay off. If I'm going to actually perpetuate fraud that will get me something, I'm going to do it with an election worker or government employee. I'm going to rig the election in some way. I'm going to make an extra ballot box appear. I'm going to tamper with the election book. I'm going to take advantage of voting by mail. I'm not going to go through the process of voting 100 times in one day face to face.

[Whisky Dude]

Lets be honest here.......The MAIN reason we KNOW voter ID laws are effective? ... The tenacity that Dems and Dem politicians have shown to fight against them.


Anybody REALLY think the reason Dems rail against those laws so hard is because they TRULY care about folks having to get an I.D? Get real.

[The Uniballer]

Good lord, you people are so blinded by your "photo ID's are oppressive" crap that you can't see the forest for the trees.  YES, photo ID's stop ballot stuffing--because you can't use somebody else's name to vote when you have to provide proof of your identity!  Eric Holder's ballot was offered to James O'Keefe because O'Keefe wasn't required to show any proof of his identity.  Had O'Keefe voted, no one would be any the wiser.  You people seem to be living in the past when a photo ID wasn't an official document and didn't have all the anti-counterfeiting built into it.  It's idiotic to think that photo ID's wouldn't prevent ballot stuffing.

How was the ballot stuffing perpetrated. What were the mechanics of it?

[Whisky Dude]

Just to prove my earlier point.........you know, those same Dems who fight soooooooo hard against the injustice LOL of voter ID laws are the very same people who fight just as hard to disallow many of our service men and womens votes. Yeah..........this is REALLY all about making sure every vote is counted! GTH otta here with THAT GARBAGE! Folks should REALLY try being honest once.....they might even find it to be refreshing.

[Whisky Dude]

.."The Dept. of justice is investigating whether the Democrat Secretary of State for Illinois has somehow forgotten to send thousands of absentee ballots out to members of the military serving overseas and in this close election climate in Illinois, these ballots now not to be counted could be decisive.
Federal election law, specifically the Overseas Voter Empowerment Act (MOVE), states that every state must mail their absentee ballots 45 days before the election. However, Cris Cray, director of Legislation at the Illinois State Board of Elections, has reported that some of Illinois’ voting jurisdictions have failed to mail ballots on time.
Reporters confirmed that Justice is investigating Illinois via a message from Justice Department spokeswoman Xochil Hinojosa...."
http://rightwingnews...-2010-election/


The Democrat Scam To Block Military Ballots Continues…..

..."New Mexico, New York, Illinois……the pattern is obvious: Block the Conservative vote of our military. It happened in 2008 and Liberals will try to block the ballots again this year. The Justice Department may act concerned, but I can guarantee you they are in no hurry to repair “the problem”. – Mayrant "

http://mayrantandrav...lots-continues/


DoJ stalling on protecting voting rights of military?


http://hotair.com/ar...ts-of-military/



Want more? I can do this all day. LMAO


All about protecting the sacredness of the vote my ARSE!

[Whisky Dude]

In fact.......we all KNOW for a FACT that many of these traitor democrats in DC would have no problem whatsoever allowing a person who isnt even a U.S citizen the right to vote while at the very same time fighting their guts out to disallow votes from people in our military fighting in a foreign war. And THIS is just one of the many reasons I LMAO right in folks faces who squeal about voter ID laws. Hypocrisy is kinda funny to me. Always has been. In fact I enjoy rubbing peoples noses in it like you rub a dogs nose in sheet.

[oldscribe]

First, that email shows absolutely nothing except that people think it could have happened. There is nothing concrete in it and they offer no proof of anything. They just make accusations.

Second, if ballot stuffing is occuring, ballot stuffing will continue even if I have to show my photo ID. The solution has nothing to do with solving the problem. It is like calling for speeding to be a felony to curb auto theft and then saying that auto theft will be reduced because of this new speeding law because thieves might speed away after they steal the car.

Why are people so fixated on laws to keep people from voting rather than trying to fix the voter fraud that occurs after we vote and that almost every article about voter fraud that we seem actually to be seeing? Election fraud is already a crime. Why don't we enforce the laws we have before adding new ones, especially before we add new ones that don't address the problem.

How dare you try to inject some sense into this argument.....

[NewfoundlandFrog]

I'd like to see computer analysis used to detect systematic voter fraud. You can look at precinct by precinct reults year to year and find outliers (like ballot stuffing) pretty easy I would think.

Voter ID laws do nothing for systematic fraud. In order to utilise the "pose as another voter" to commit fraud you'd have to 1. know that a person is on the roll to vote and 2. know that that person isn't going to vote. The effort and coordination to take advantage of that on a scale that would actually matter would be prohibitive.

OTOH, systematic voter fraud like ballot stuffing, or "ballot losing", would get you a lot more bang for the buck. Those are the things we should spend effort and money on preventing.

Absolutely correct BUT: Your primary problem is that you are not considering the desired bang that the people advocating the position actually want to see.

[NewfoundlandFrog]

First, that email shows absolutely nothing except that people think it could have happened. There is nothing concrete in it and they offer no proof of anything. They just make accusations...

Hey there...It was seen in an e-mail on Internet. It MUST be true.

[Frog79]

My Ohio relatives (Democrats all the way) are convinced that it was voter fraud that elected a Republican governor and a GOP state rep in their district....

Then surely these good Democrats back voter ID laws to prevent these nasty Republican voter fraud schemes?

[Frog79]

Sorry, duplicate post.

[KillerFrog InD KitchenSink]

For me, you never give a medicine without looking at the side effects. If we catch the rare case of someone impersonating another voter but deter thousands of legal voters who because of age or circumstance don't have IDs, that is not worth it.

Spend the money on making voter rolls are more accurate by doing a better job removing dead peoples names. Use computer algorithms and previous year's data to detect precinct irregularities perpetrated by some party hack. But with voter IDs the juice just isn't worth the squeeze.